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Paper vs. Computer
m2e
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 607
Best Total: 16m 43s
Posted - 2006.06.08 07:40:50
I've been wondering if people prefer solving these problems on paper or on the computer. I started Slither links on paper, and so the move onto computer left me confused at first.
Good things about paper
- You can have your own symbols for specific things!!! (this was a big one for me)
- do it where ever you want
-you can colour in the loops to see it more clearly (i realise this has been fixed)
required more logic rather than fix position

Good things about computer
-Neatness!!! (it was more easy to see loops with the computer and i didnt need to colour in anymore)
-community and competition
-fix position
-if you make a mistake you can correct yourself without making it messy.

So right now i prefer computer for small puzzles, but for larger puzzles (larger than the weekend puzzles found on this site) i prefer paper. What do other peope think?
foilman
Kwon-Tom Admin
Puzzles: 1720
Best Total: 24m 8s
Posted - 2006.06.08 07:45:54
I think I agree with most of your points, I often print off a HUGE puzzle if I'm going on a long flight - sometimes the really big ones can keep me busy for hours, and they're fun to do on paper. So much more thinking ahead that you have to do entirely in your head!
m2e
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 607
Best Total: 16m 43s
Posted - 2006.06.08 07:50:40
theres always pencil and an eraser if you get desperate
but yeah fix position has changed my habits quite a bit. i think this is quite extreme but there was one puzzle that, well, this is how i solved it:
1) attempted it once
2) attempted it twice
3) attempted it for the 3rd time
**each time i i got around 1/2 of the way through without mistakes**
4) circled all the differences in all the puzzles (these were parts i found an answer for a part that wasnt very obvious)
5) attempted it for the FOURTh time using all the thinking from the previous 3 tries and finnally got an answer.
i cant remember how long it took me but it was at last a few days. After using fix position i would never be bothered for that!!
Last edited by m2e - 2006.06.08 07:51:06
lodenkamper
Kwon-Tom Fan
Puzzles: 21
Best Total: 47m 58s
Posted - 2006.06.08 20:46:16
I generally tend to prefer paper to computer, especially for large puzzles.  Staring and clicking for the time it would take to do a typical large puzzle (e.g., 31x45) would be difficult for me.

In the FAQ, foilman indicates that he can generate puzzles that are larger than the weekend 14x20 puzzles, but that the web interface is too slow for such large puzzles.

Would it be possible to add a section to this site that has a few large puzzles statically displayed (so they can be printed out), but which are not playable on-line in the usual sense (something like a "beast of the month" perhaps)?  I really like puzzles which are both large and hard, and this site is by far the best on-line ongoing source of challenging puzzles that I'm aware of.
Last edited by lodenkamper - 2006.06.08 23:08:01
foilman
Kwon-Tom Admin
Puzzles: 1720
Best Total: 24m 8s
Posted - 2006.06.08 23:07:18
Yes, that would be possible, and it is something I have thought about doing. I think the original plan was to have one "large and very time consuming" puzzle per month, for print-out only (or perhaps also for export to a Slither Link application). Like you say, standard javascript isn't really suitable for the huge puzzles, so the normal way they're done wouldn't be possible.

The puzzle database actually already has a few larger than normal puzzles, there's just not currently an easy way to display them. I'll see what I can do!

PS I like your suggestion for the name: "Beast Of The Month"!
Last edited by foilman - 2006.06.08 23:08:11
m2e
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 607
Best Total: 16m 43s
Posted - 2006.06.09 01:28:05
Good idea for the monthly beast!

on a side note: did people using pencil+paper create their own symbols? I was wondering if im alone here or this is quite common.
Helge
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 3021
Best Total: 11m 26s
Posted - 2006.06.09 07:07:48
Foilman, from where do you get your HUGE puzzles? I need some too!
Tilps
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 4324
Best Total: 20m 22s
Posted - 2006.06.09 07:12:32
I'm sure foilman's program is perfectly capable of generating large puzzles.

My one works well enough for lage puzzles.  Generating a 30x30 puzzle takes quite a while if you turn the difficulty level up, 40x40 even more so, but it still works.  Only problem with 40x40 is you have to turn the font size down, otherwise it won't fit on the screen.
foilman
Kwon-Tom Admin
Puzzles: 1720
Best Total: 24m 8s
Posted - 2006.06.09 08:10:42
Yes, the same thing that creates all the puzzles on here can create them at any size... from tiny up to super-massive. Of course, it takes a while for it to come up with the really big ones... but I'm definitely planning on adding them to the site for print-out only.
Helge
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 3021
Best Total: 11m 26s
Posted - 2006.06.09 11:13:36
That's great news!
mathmaniac
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 1198
Best Total: 20m 57s
Posted - 2006.06.09 11:50:15
Where do you think you are going to add them? (e.g. Home)
foilman
Kwon-Tom Admin
Puzzles: 1720
Best Total: 24m 8s
Posted - 2006.06.09 14:09:51
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathmaniac
Where do you think you are going to add them? (e.g. Home)
I don't know, I haven't thought that far ahead yet! Well the archives will definitely have to have one per month, so that's ok, but the current month's.... possibly like you say, under the Home link.
Acorn
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 555
Best Total: 42m 58s
Posted - 2006.06.12 14:19:39
I don't use symbols when I do my puzzles on paper.  I do most of the puzzle in pen and when I'm stuck I use pencil to see if a route works or not. 

http://janko.at/Raetsel/ has a few larger size puzzles.  It's not in english but it doesn't really matter.  I find their large puzzles quite difficult.
foilman
Kwon-Tom Admin
Puzzles: 1720
Best Total: 24m 8s
Posted - 2006.06.12 14:25:00
I managed to make a bit of progress on this over the weekend... it's now possible to display a puzzle as an image, so the really big ones are displayed almost instantly. They don't print so well... in firefox it's possible to scale the print by doing a print-preview & changing the size drop-down, but that doesn't seem possible in Internet Explorer.

Anyway, for now (until I remove it) here's a sample Super-Big puzzle as an image which you MIGHT be able to print... (you could try saving it to your local machine & printing it another way - let me know how you get on with that if you try it)...

Super-Big Puzzle Test (no longer available here... check your home page!)
Last edited by foilman - 2006.06.14 14:40:47
Acorn
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 555
Best Total: 42m 58s
Posted - 2006.06.12 14:32:28
I saved it and then when I opened my saved document it automatically used  Windows and Picture viewer (I use XP).  It prints out just fine from there.  I'll do it this week.  Probably tonight.
mathmaniac
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 1198
Best Total: 20m 57s
Posted - 2006.06.12 15:11:23
It printed out fine but I had a little trouble trying to fit it onto a regular piece of printing paper. I had to make it a tad smaller!
astrokath
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 3093
Best Total: 13m 42s
Posted - 2006.06.12 18:56:04
Whoa, that was big!

1hr 12 mins, it took me.
foilman
Kwon-Tom Admin
Puzzles: 1720
Best Total: 24m 8s
Posted - 2006.06.12 20:44:27
Quote:
Originally Posted by astrokath
1hr 12 mins, it took me.
That's pretty good...! I've not timed myself doing one that size, but I'm sure it takes me at least a couple of hours, if not more... then again, I've not done one like that for a long time so armed with all my new patterns I'd probably be much better at it.
mathmaniac
Kwon-Tom Obsessive
Puzzles: 1198
Best Total: 20m 57s
Posted - 2006.06.12 21:19:28
I've been going on and off with it. I've been watching a lot of world cup games!
lodenkamper
Kwon-Tom Fan
Puzzles: 21
Best Total: 47m 58s
Posted - 2006.06.12 23:46:22


For pencil (or pen) and paper solving, one notation I've found useful is to put a diagonal slash through a 2 if I know the two corners at the slash will be connected.

For example, here the slash would go from the top right of the 2 to the lower left of the 2.
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